Divine Light Magazine No 4

I'M GOING TO MAKE YOU PERFECT

Answers from Guru Maharaj Ji, London October — November, 1971.

Any questions you would like to ask?

Guru Maharaj Ji, what advice can you give us concerning the scriptures! The Koran, the Bible, the Buddhist scriptures?

See, these are scriptures. And when you say scriptures you mean scriptures. And what is the meaning of scriptures? Scriptures are dead. You know that? Scriptures are dead. Probably you think that there is an Essene gospel somewhere around here. Look in an Essene gospel. It is clearly written there that these scriptures are dead and we need a living master for living Word.

But can it not help us to read the scriptures if we know God?

Well your eyes can help you to read the scriptures and the scriptures can help to take your memory back to an age in history but this is only a little bit of help. And probably somebody can't read the scriptures, then? How will he be helped? They give information really but it is not important information.

But many of them are beautiful writings.

Why not? They can be beautiful writings. There are beautiful essays about dogs even. Arenlet there! Beautiful essays about dogs! (ha, ha). So, anything else? You understand now?

Yes

Scriptures are beautiful I agree. And I read them and I like them, but only to a limited level. That's as much as I like them you know. Then I close them and keep them, that's all. They can help me to understand how saints were helping the people previously. But I can't apply those methods completely here. This method has to be completely new. Knowledge is the original thing, you know that. I can't change the Knowledge but the way, the method, to bring it to people, that should be absolutely changed. Because now people haven't got so much time. They haven't got so much time. They haven't got time to read the newspapers, so how can they have time to stay in an ashram for two or three years and then … you know all that. You understand!

But if one wants to read the scriptures, should one?

Please welcome. Nobody can refuse you. Anything more? Yes?

Guru Maharaj Ji, what is that precise thing that a devotee does that pleases the Guru absolutely amongst worldly things?

Service.

What kind?

Well the first thing is to be in His agya. This is the most pleasurable communication. Now, this wire of agya is so thick, you know, that Satguru Himself can get inside it and come to you. Because you always have to be in His presence and you always have to be in His communication. When you die there will be a new agya. This is the best, best, best thing. Forever. I am talking to you personally now. This is the best thing. Nothing can be more than this that I am recommending. It is the most recommended thing. You understand?

Some people say if you really want something you won't get it, if you don't want it you will get it.

That is the case with them. They hate Knowledge, and they hate God, so they are not getting it. See? I wanted to see God, I tried for it, I got it.

Sometimes when I try to do things it makes me upset, but when I try not to think of anything except the Name and try not to do a certain thing, then it seems much more peaceful.

Yes, because you are doing nothing there. You are just idly sitting down there. You like to rest, so don't do anything, just sit down and try to remember the Word, it is really comfortable! But the thing is this, a man has to get into practice with this thing. And then that is more comfortable than sitting around. There are many people who can't sit idle. They sit idle and they get sick. So, just try to remember the Holy Word, no don't try to remember it, just remember it, you know, don't try to remember it. You know it is the most essential thing. You should be always with the Word. There is no question of trying. It must be

10

there. It is a must. And once you are remembering that Holy Word all your work will be carrying on very nicely, you know, very beautifully.

Does this mean I should have no desires.

No, wait, you know that you must have desires. Because God has created a computer which will create desires. But this computer should not be used for other things. It just should be there. To listen to satsang, to give satsang, you know, to help a man, and so on. But desires which are extra shouldn't be there.

Oh, there are two types of desire?

Yea!

Guru Maharaj Ji, why did the people kill Jesus Christ?

You know, I never killed Jesus Christ. They killed Him.

Why did they do that?

You also did that so you ask yourself! You did that purposely because it had to happen. If Jesus Christ wasn't crucified nobody would have respected him. Everybody can remember Jesus Christ because he was hanging up on the cross. And that was the crucification, and if that crucification had not taken place nobody would have respected Jesus Christ.

Are they going to respect you?

Yes, I'm going to be strict about it.

What is the purpose of all the other teachers that are on the earth now?

When there is a tree, besides that tree there are many weeds. Right? And these weeds are unnecessary. What do they do there? They are just there. And when this tree is really going to be something it is going to abolish these weeds. Then you will find no sign of them.

Is there no purpose at all then?

None at all. None at all. They are unnecessary. They're just wasting one's time. People go to them, then it takes five years for them to decide no, no, he is not a true master, let me look for something else. And then they go to somebody else and they waste their time again. They waste five years unnecessarily. There is no use in this. To waste five years of your time. It is always unnecessary. If there is only one master, you know, everybody can rush to Him. But because there are these weeds they are stopped from coming.

Why are people doubtful, why are people so doubtful when we give satsang, when we speak to them?

They think that this is external soul, because the world is becoming so artificial today. They think, no, no, no, this is not the real thing. But when you give them more and more satsang and when they see real reality, then they will realize "Ah, he means it". So eventually they come to their point. You know you take the iron, hammer it, and you won't put it in shape. But make it hot, red hot, and then beat it, it is easily put into its right position. So these people are crazy! First they must be put in the fire, then they must be hammered. When they are just this narrow, then give them dirt satsang to get rid of their dirt and this dirt satsang makes them feel so jealous, and all the jealousy that's in their heart comes out. And they are pure. Pure for one second. And this purity for one second lets in the satsang that you have been giving. And they think about it. So they accept it after all this. But their jealousy should come out first. And it comes out as you give satsang. Yes!

Guru Maharaj Ji, both the Buddha and Jesus Christ spoke of coming again, I don't know if other Gurus did as well. What did They in fact mean?

The thing is this, did the man who was writing the Bible talk about coming again or did Jesus Christ himself say it? Jesus Christ has written no Bible. Try to remember that. Jesus Christ wrote no Bible. But He will come again. The thing is, people make mistakes about the words.

What does that mean?

He will come again! It really means that He will again come to this western world, and He'll be laughing. He'll again come to this western world with the bright Light and He will shower this upon humanity. He means it. On this western world He probably meant. And whether it's true or not, nobody knows it. Nobody can guarantee that. But Christian people sort of try to conflict themselves, try to constrict themselves by the sentences. First of all they say He will come. But if somebody has

11

gone out of this house only then can he come back in. If somebody is already in this house how can he come back in? Eh? So they say He will come, and then they say He never died.

Oh, but doesn't that mean that He will come back in the flesh?

Yes, He will come back again. And how will He come back? In which flesh will He come, or in which Light will He come? That is not described. This sentence hasn't got an introduction to it, it is an incomplete sentence. So be on your own. You be on your own. Try to see that which is living, not dead.

But the Bible, The New Testament, tells that Jesus is living now.

So Jesus is living, right! Jesus is living. Ram is living now, Krishna is living now, Buddha is living now, but they all have been united. All their powers have been united into one very, very, very, very powerful power. And when this power spreads it's hand, you know, like this, something is going to happen. All this, all the things that are going on wrong in this world are going to be abolished.

Will it be very long?

Very shortly. He is starting to move His hand now, you know. Try to understand. You people, not only you people, I want to say this whole world, reads the Bible and tries to understand it through their minds, right? They can't understand it. Spirituality cannot be described and it cannot be understood by the mind. Mind is imperfect. How can it understand? Whatever it understands is absolutely wrong. Absolutely wrong. Because the mind will always project what is false. Mind is a

12

black light. And whatever is projected from it is black. No purity. Nothing pure can be projected from this mind. Just try to see how it really is.

Guru Maharaj Ji, how can you help us through this game we play on this planet?

I'm going to supervise you, and stop you wherever you play wrong. That is all. I'm going to give you this Knowledge, I'm going to make you perfect in this game. And it won't be a qualifying game any more, it will be the final game. Now people are about to play a real game and this is the final. So I'm going to make you perfect for that. Just have some patience and see what happens! Just see, how far out this game is going to be, how far out will be the things that happen! Have some patience in your head, and you'll see how this little room is going to be on the other side of the river. How this world is going to float over this ocean of materialism and inhumanity and all that is here. All this world is going to float over it, and go to the other side where there is purity, purity, purity all the time. And you're going to see how it goes. Like a hovercraft but faster!

Guru Maharaj Ji, I was carrying a bill board with the poster about the ant and elephant, and this guy came up and he read it alright, and he comes up to me and he says, "I see God in everything", and I don't know what to say.

You should have congratulated him. Just congratulate him, and he'd have walked two steps away and would have said, "Well, I wanted to make a fool of him and he made a fool of me". He would just think and come back again to you.

I didn't want to make a fool of him.

You don't want to make a fool of him, but actually you are making a fool of him. Because he is telling a lie.

Making a fool of himself.

Himself, right. He is telling a lie and you are congratulating him on this lie, so he says, "I tried to fool him but he has fooled me. I should go back and probably I should apologize". Then he comes and listens to you and he's a very subdued man now and he's very good! Nothing is wrong anymore. You are all pagal, pagal. You know?

What's that?

It means mad, crazy! But really in Hindi it means Ta Liya. You've found out the great secret, that's the meaning of pagal. Just found out the great secret. Anything more you want to ask now?

Guru Maharaj Ji, there's a rumour going round that you're going to fly the Jumbo Jet.

So I'm going to fly the Jumbo Jet, why not? I planned the Jumbo Jet and now the Jumbo Jet is flying, because I planned it. I planned it, you know. Yes?

Is it possible to contact the bodies of those spirits that are Dead?

You want to contact them? Take a walkie-talkie and start contacting them. Say Mr. so-and-so so-and-so, I am talking with you. These are not things that you should do. When you try just to think about these things, even then you are simply wasting your time, because these are not proper things to do. People study and experience things within witchcraft, but are just simply wasting their time. They get nothing out of it. There is nothing. People try to read books about spirits, about how ghosts come and disturb men. They get nothing out of it, so it is simply wasting their time. And at the same time serving God or searching Truth will be helped by the Knowledge about seven times more than they are being helped by studying witchcraft and all that. See?

So that is why I say this world is crazy. The world is blind, To whom should I explain? Kabirdas says that this whole world is blind, to whom should I talk? Everybody is blind. They cannot see what is the real face, what is the real feature of God, so what should the real do? Today people take a small thing and think this is God. People today go to some place and think this is God. People try to make money from God. It is life.

Once, what happened? There were four blind people and they wanted to see an elephant. And they sat beside the road to see the elephant, and a man came with elephant and he asked them "Why are you sitting here?" and they said, "We want to see an elephant;', and he said "O.K, here is the elephant. Now you can see". And they all started touching it. One took the trunk of the elephant and experienced the trunk. Then he left the elephant. Another went to the foot and he experienced that. Another went to the tail and experienced that. Another went to the tusk and experienced that. The last one went to the ear and he experienced that. They said "Thank you very much, we have seen the elephant now you can go", and the elephant man went away. And they all started discussing the nature of the elephant. One said "The elephant is a long, thick branch".

He was the one who experienced the trunk.

13

Prem Rawat aka Guru Maharaj Ji in 1971 Another said "No! the elephant is a long, thin branch". This one had experienced the tail. Another said "No! You are both wrong; the elephant is like a tree-trunk". This one had experienced the foot. The other, who had experienced the ear, said "No! You three are wrong, the elephant is like a banana leaf". But was the elephant a trunk, a trunk of a tree, the branch of a tree or a banana leaf? No, it was not. The elephant was something else altogether, but because they had only touched that thing they could only say that the elephant was that.

So, this is the grief of people today. They think ah, this is the situation so we will do that; but no, this is the situation so they will do this; and no again, this is the situation so they will do that. So it is like the elephant. They are blind people and they see God in the sea then say this is a feature like God and they start experiencing that. Many people today have got photos of Jesus Christ in their houses and they pray to them. Many people today have got photos of Krishna today in their house and they are praying to these photos. But tell me, is that the photo of Jesus Christ, or Krishna, or Rama or anybody else, eh? There was no photographer at the time of Christ or Krishna or Ram who would take the photos and develop them. It is just artistic imagination that they are exercising in the photos of Ram, Krishna and Jesus Christ. No-one knows who was like Jesus Christ, what were his features. Today we see a photo and we believe Jesus Christ was like that. Was Jesus Christ really like that? It is artistic imagination, artistic inspiration, that is all. And that is why we have started believing that God is like a human man, and you want to see him in a form. But. God is not like that. God is divine, God is pure. God is energy. Energy which cannot be created, which cannot be destroyed. Which dwells amongst all. All dwells amongst him. It is that energy, and we, our souls, are broken parts of that energy who have eventually to go and reunite with that energy. It is the energy which was never created and which will never be destroyed. On the basis of that energy, this world is existing. And on the theory and formula of that energy everything has been created. This is the supreme and primordial vibration that was, and from that primordial vibration everything is coming out. Why don't you think what you can see is a vibration? This is a vibration; my hand is a vibration, my body is a vibration and whatever you can see is a vibration. It is a bad vibration because of the primordial vibration. And it is that primordial vibration that you have to realize. Once we have realized that we have to vibrate in the vibration.

Does evil come from our mind?

Right! Exactly. Do you know, the devil is the son of man that comes to mind, through mind, from mind.

Then it is not real?

Not at all. The thing which is real is so glorious, so glorious, it cannot be explained. After all it is real, that is why it cannot be explained. It has got so much truth in it that wherever it drops in, man is completely intoxicated there. Not with wine, not with rum, not with beer, but with that alcohol which has been created by God. That is the alcohol which Jesus Christ used to take and be intoxicated by all day and this is the alcohol that is within us. That is the alcohol which makes us intoxicated and whatever devil is within us we forget him and he goes out. It is just anti-dote to that alcohol which we drink here. We just forget who we are when we drink the alcohol of the world but in this alcohol we know who we are. We forget everything outside but we know who we are. And this is divine intoxication which all the saints have taken and all the disciples take. If they do not take this intoxication they won't be existing for very much longer.

How can we completely overcome the illusion of mind?

Illusion was not created by God so it can be very easily fixed, by meditation, by service and by satsang. These three are anti-dotes. They are anti-

14

tablets to the other three — illusion, delusion, and pollution. Whatever you call it. Same thing. If you want illusion taken away from you very quickly try three things at a time, meditation satsang and service. If you can do meditation, it is more than enough to carry your illusion from you, but it takes some time. But if you do meditation and service, all the illusion, delusion and pollution will be all carried away. Because these are the things that make the windows very misty.

Have you any questions to ask? Yes!

Is it bad to feel sad about things?

Yes. Because sadness was not created originally. The origin of anything was happiness, and sadness was created by man when Adam and Eve had to betray God. That's when sadness was created; and Adam and Eve became sad then because they had to separate from God. So why should man be sad? People are sad because somebody dies but why be sad? They aren't out of the world, they are in the world somewhere. They are not just out of something. They are in the world. Probably they are getting rest. So nobody should be sad; everybody should be happy. There is no cause for anybody to be sad within the world.

You see I was thinking when children are violent in front of you it is very difficult not to be affected.

See, when fire burns, everything is affected. Only those materials which are fireproof are not affected by fire. Why shouldn't we be sadproof? Then 13 sadness can come and touch us. We should all be sadproof.

When meditating is it possible to defeat all illness?

Why do you take Knowledge? Why do you do meditation?

To find, to find what God is.

You want to attain peace, right? So, suppose I know that this particular car can solve my purpose to take me from this place to that place. If I make it an aeroplane and if I take it to the runway and put it at full speed so that it will run and take off, can it serve the purpose of an aeroplane? So meditation is for peace; it is not a medicine to take away our illnesses. Why is illness created? Illness is created because it is a punishment given to us hand to hand. If I take my bath in a warm water and come out into cold I will have a fever, right? So that is a .punishment. It is to tell us, to indicate to us, that this absolutely wrong, that this is out of law. It shows that it is illegal in the eyes of nature to do this. But if we stay like a human being as we are supposed to stay no illness can come towards us. If we stay neat and clean, tidy, pure in heart and pure in body no illness can come to us. But because we don't stay like human beings illness just runs towards us. I don't think illnesses should come to us but they do come because we aren't pure in hearf and we aren't pure in body. That's all. And so it is good to have a punishment; welcome it because it will teach you a lesson. But once you know the lesson you shouldn't commit the mistake a second time. Understand

Sometimes when you get illnesses you don't know your mistakes.

What do you mean?

I'm an epileptic. As I'm an epileptic I have epileptic attacks and I don't know the reason for it.

There are passing diseases which are passed from one man to other. If a man is not careful of himself then the disease is passed to him, that is all. A man is well today and tomorrow he gets ill. Not because he has done anything wrong, but because it is a passing disease which has come him and it came to him because he was not careful with himself. If you are clean, inside and out, you cannot look dirty. You have today these modern clothes, you have seen these. They look like dirty clothes. Because they . . . there aren't really patches in them but they have been made on the design of patches and very dirty clothes. True? When a man wears them if you look quickly he will look very dirty and untidy, but when you stop and look more carefully you will find it is only a pattern. It is only a design and the clothes are not really dirty. See? It is the same way with us. We shouldn't be ill and if we are even then we should prevent ourselves. So this body is a temple of God. It is the greatest gift that God has given us. It really is the most useful gift to us practically. Through this gift we can do several things. And through this gift today mankind has been able to reach the moon, to dive under the suface of the sea, to go to many places. So we should look after this temple carefully, so that it may not be dirty or have something wrong with it.

Guru Maharaj Ji will you tell us the story of love.

Story of love? There is no story of love. Love is something which cannot be put into stories. Love is not a story. Love is such a thing it can enable you to communicate with anything in the world. It is the most perfect communication. Even if you want to communicate with God you will have to have this love. But what is love? Love

15

should not be selfish. Today mankind loves that thing only which can satisfy his selfish purposes completely. A man will only love those things which can give him something in return. If a cow is giving milk the man will say 'oh my cow, oh my cow'. But the next day the cow stops giving milk. Because he is selfish he will first of all kill the cow. So all these loves that human man transmits through his body are selfish loves. But the love towards God should not be selfish. Real love should not be selfish. In America if you go out today you might see a pair, a couple, who will come out of the cnurch and get in the car; they both are married and they both are very happy. They go in their house, they play the grammophones or their radios and they are very happy. They go to the pictures and so on. And after a week or so the husband gets angry with his wife and they both divorce each other. And the couple finishes. This is only selfishness. Because when the husband was getting some calm and satisfaction out of his wife, he was loving her. But as soon as she got angry they were divorced. So, this is human man. He shouldn't have this type of love. Love should be permanent, consistant. Prize it. It should not descend it should ascend. It should be non-selfish love. This the main story of love. Yes?

Sometimes I get an incredible amount of emotion, you know, tears. What is that and how should I deal with that?

You see, crying is good because all the bad water in your eyes comes out. Very good. Gopies always were crying. You know who the gopies were? If you saw gopies, they were always crying. Gopies never laugh, gopies never have time to laugh. Gopies were meant to cry. They were meant to cry, that's why the Lord of the Universe leaves them, you know. The Lord of the Universe leaves them. First of all He makes friends with them, you know, saying, "Oh, gopies, oh gopies, oh gopies!" And then they become quite a friend of His and then He says, "Well, I'm leaving you" and off He goes. So what can they do now? They recognized that He is the Lord of the Universe, and He is just everything and He is their friend, and they are all happy. And now when they see that He is leaving, how can they say to their eyes, "Don't weep"? They just start weeping; the gopies were meant to weep. And that's why they always weep. When Krishna was there, when they saw the lilas of Krishna, they used to cry in happiness. And when Krishna left them they used to cry in sadness. And you know this a very beautiful description.

One day I was sitting in my room, in my office, in Dehra Dun and this is at a great height, 16 very very cool, and fresh air comes, from Mussorie, or from the Himalayas, and I was sitting there. It was night time, and I had a blue light in my room, it was a very beautiful blue light. And the whole room was blue and I was writing a book. And I wrote that these gopies were standing here in the shade of a tree, of a big tree, and they were talking about their Krishna, saying, "Ah, well Krishna will be there, and Krishna will be . . ." And they were weeping, and they were talking about their Krishna, they were saying, "Oh, Krishna will be doing this," and "Krishna will be doing that, there will be discourse going on". And they ultimately come to a point when they say, "Well, Krishna likes us", and they start weeping like anything. And then they see that a chariot is coming. And all the cows, who were also weeping, all these cows go and stop and gaze at this chariot, and it looks like the tears which were rolling down from the eyes of the gopies have stopped. Just to see whether Krishna has come or not. And these tears meant to say, "Let us stop on the cheeks and just see if Lord Krishna has come. If Lord Krishna has come let us drop down for him, then it will be O.K. But if we drop down without Lord Krishna it will be nothing to us".

And these gopies just stand there on this balance. Sometimes they are filled with joy that Krishna has come, for the chariot seems to be same thing. And sometimes they are sad saying, "Oh no, Krishna hasn't come", and again two tears roll down from their eyes and they are very sad. And when they think Lord Krishna has come, they are so happy. And they have this conflict - what will be their luck, what will be their fortune? Will they be happy, or will they be sad? And ultimately when they see, when they really see that after all this is not Krishna they cry, they cry, they cry like anything. They couldn't help themselves. They say, "No, if this is not Krishna, then He is so cruel that we wouldn't have loved Him."

Just so, you know. Gopies were always meant to cry; they were always crying throughout their lives. Sometimes in happiness, even then they cry. And sometimes in sadness, even then they cry. It's a really beautiful story about gopies. The real, sincere love they had towards Krishna. It's rare to find such a love. You'll find any other love today. You find boys kissing girls right in the middle of the market. But you can't find the sincere love that Krishna and the gopies had. It was a real communication that they had between them. It was so firm and beautiful, what they had. It was filled with such sincerity that it seemed that this was the only love that could exist in their lifetime. The love these gopies had used to flow out from them without stopping. This was real love,

16

Published by Divine Light Mission, "Fern Bank", Golden Manor, Hanwell, W. 7. Tel 567 6142 Printed by Covent Garden Press Ltd., London W.C.2.